By Gus Saltonstall
Following a shooting near the corner of West 71st Street and Broadway on Halloween night that left two teenagers injured, community stakeholders met on Monday in front of the McDonald’s on the block to discuss possible solutions for a spot many describe as a “problem plaza.”
“The shooting was a horror that woke people up,” City Councilmember Gale Brewer told West Side Rag. “We have design issues on this street, and yes, we should have done more earlier, but there is a real need to work together and find solutions.”
A map of shootings since 2020 shows that the incident this Halloween is the third such shooting to take place near the corner in that time frame. Separately, the now-shuttered Lincoln Convenience smoke shop on West 71st Street and Broadway was also robbed three times in 2022, including once at gunpoint when a man was shot within the store after trying to intervene.
The majority of speakers on Monday suggested that the elevated number of incidents on the West 71st Street corner had to do with the congestion that the corner faces.
The meeting, held in front of a McDonald’s near the corner, was organized by Brewer and attended by other elected officials (State Assemblymember Linda Rosenthal and State Senator Brad Hoylman-Sigal), as well as by representatives of police, several city departments, community groups, and the McDonald’s Corporation.
Deputy Inspector Candida Pun-Sullivan, commanding officer of NYPD’s 20th Precinct, told the gathering that police officers will be stationed around the clock at the West 71st Street and Broadway corner for “the foreseeable future,” but did not specify the exact time frame.
Speakers described several factors that make the corner area congested. Food delivery workers congregate outside the McDonald’s, as do high school students after school. There’s a sidewalk cafe outside the nearby Little Italy restaurant and a train station nearby for the 1, 2, and 3 lines.
“When there is so much going on at a corner, there is more risk of something bad taking place,” Brewer said during her remarks.
Brewer’s office confirmed to West Side Rag that one of the two teenagers shot on Halloween is a student at the nearby Martin Luther King Jr. Educational Campus on Amsterdam Avenue between West 65th and 66th streets. The shooting happened around the corner on West 71st Street toward West End Avenue, but the teenager from the MLK school then walked into the McDonald’s and asked for help.
The meeting discussed several steps to be considered to reduce congestion on that block — and hopefully also lead to fewer incidents of violence. Among the ideas: developing more after-school programming for students from the MLK campus and installing a bike corral on the block to make more room for pedestrians.
“High school kids hang out here, kids with nothing to do after school,” Rosenthal said. “But the guns are a huge issue. It’s kids with guns, that’s the scary part.”
“This problem plaza has been a vexing issue for close to a decade,” Hoylman-Sigal said during his remarks. “We need solutions.”
At one point, remarks were interrupted when a man emerged from the McDonald’s building and addressed the group. “We’ve talked publicly about the problem on this block three times before, and each time, police have remained for a few weeks and then left,” said the man, who did not give his name but identified himself as the property manager for the building. “We need to get the kids off the block. The bike racks aren’t shooting people, the trash bins aren’t shooting people, the kids are shooting here.”
Brewer responded that she agreed and that the focus was finding better options for the students.
Multiple other people brought up the outdoor dining set up in front of Little Italy, which West Side Rag could not find a permit for within the city’s database. A representative from the Department of Transportation said she had taken photos of the outdoor cafe and sent them to supervisors at the agency to confirm it was non-compliant.
The gathering ended with the elected officials leading the group on a walk down West 71st Street, and an agreement to organize a follow-up meeting that could contribute to finding more options for local students after school, and the city agencies that could help de-clutter the block.
Subscribe to West Side Rag’s FREE email newsletter here.
Hoylman-Sigal said during his remarks. “We need solutions.”
– Isn’t that exactly his job?
“We need to look to the future of 71st and Amsterdam and turn the page. Let’s not move backwards, but instead go forward with joy. It’s not just the differences but also the sameness of this street corner that provides equity and resilience to the people living somewhere. And I will envision the changes for this street corner in the tomorrow land!” – Kamala Harris
He is incredibly caring and pro-active, but solutions need to go through many “proper” channels before change can be implemented. He is not solely responsible for coming up with solutions and enacting them into policy. He deserves our support as he tries to push these changes through the bureaucracy of our city.
“When there is so much going on at a corner, there is more risk of something bad taking place,” Brewer said
Interesting, if not counterintuitive. I always assumed crimes happen in dimly lit or less trafficked areas. Perhaps that was “old days” where perps feared getting caught….
The MLK complex has metal detectors. The students don’t have guns with thrm at school.
Close the McDonald’s. That’s half the problem solved right there. Turn it into a bookstore or something benign like that. No more weed shops either. Get rid of the bike racks. Put at least two police officers on this block on a full-time basis.
Personally, it would not ruin my day at all if the McDonald’s were not there, but how would that work? How do you make a privately owned business shut down if the owner doesn’t wish to shut it down? And while I’d love to see a bookstore there, it’s a sad fact that brick and mortar bookstores are not a terribly profitable enterprise nowadays. What could they do in addition to selling books to turn a profit? I know – they could sell weed 🙂 !
I pass by every day and I only went inside once. Every McD’s is a hub for fights. Seen enough. Stopped years ago when I realized cheap sweet tea could give me diabetes.
I am not a fan of McDonald’s but they are a business. They have a right to do business without chaos and interference from people breaking the law or interrupting their business. It is up to our city officials to keep order on our streets and sidewalks, not the business.
Nice idea. But the reality is that not all businesses generate the kinds of problems that McDonald’s seems to provoke. When they set up shop near three schools, trouble will follow.
I’m sorry to hear that this was ‘the wake-up call.’ I moved to 72nd & Broadway in 2012. There are posts in previous threads claiming that this wasn’t happening 10 years ago. Between the sidewalk sheds on 68th, McDonald’s and DR and the subway station on 72nd, there were dozens of violent incidents. At some point pre-Covid a friend asked me to to go over to McDonald’s to pick up gift cards. There were armed guards wearing flak jackets stationed at both doors and asking for IDs. When I asked what was going on the police motioned to the group of ‘kids,’ who had moved to the median across the street. That should have been ‘the wake-up call.’ : (
I totally agree with Councilperson Brewer! If these kids had some meaningful engagement with after-school programming such as underwater basketweaving seminars, they would NOT be out there shooting each other.
Why has no one thought of this sooner?!
The root cause of this is horrible parents. Start sending the parents to Jail for the crimes of their children and this will be less likly to happen in the future.
Blaming the parents is an easy out. Most of these parents are working two jobs and are desperately trying to keep their households together – and they don’t get any help from the govt. Just TV pix of Eric Adams in another new suit, prior to taking bribes and going on free trips.
Sorry Eizabeth I agree with John. Lots of lower-income parents who have less time to spend with their children still transmit high standards of behavior and insist on accomplishment. This is a parenting issue, and also perhaps a cultural one.
When I went to school, I was not allowed to do anything until I finished my homework. If these kids have homework they can finish before 9 pm, they don’t have enough homework!
Another problem is the sidewalk in front of McDonalds – it’s way to spacious. If McDonald’s moved to a place where there was far less room, there would be less room to congregate.
and how would you do that? What crimes have the parents committed? Like it or not, simply being a “horrible parent” is not a criminal offense.
Why is it that some kids manage to find things to do that keeps them out of trouble while others don’t?
How many meaningful programs do we have to pay for that seem to accomplish nothing?
“Someone should do something”
—Gale Brewer, career politician who has been in a position to do something for decades
As they say talk is cheap. And nothing is done. Another photo/tv op.
A few suggestions:
– Is McDonald’s corporate aware of this? I think these issues are costing them a lot of business, and hurting their reputation. Perhaps they can help.
– Make this a no loitering zone. Cops should tell people to move along. There are plenty of other places to hang out. Yes, there is a chance this will just result in the issues relocating elsewhere, but I will take that chance.
– Get all of the bikes out of the way. The UWS is overrun with delivery riders. I am doing my part and rarely order in anymore. I know there is a small portion of the population who can’t go out easily. But for the rest of you, either go pick up your own sushi or live without it.
Unfortunately, NY state does not have a “NO LOITERING” law. It’s surprising but the reality. Trust me, every store owner would love that because when people do want to congregate, it’s considered “public space” and the police have no right to move anyone along. I know and have made my voice heard up the chain of officials for city and state. Unless more people speak up, it will stay this way. Loitering is allowed by law.
On Oct 16 I wrote Gale to tell her something bad was about to happen due to the increase in illegal activity. I had to call 911 to report weapons issues that same day! She did nothing. This was preventable but due to the continued neglect of our representatives kids are shooting each other. We must vote them out.
We don’t need a gathering to understand what’s going on, we need our City & State elected officials to stop passing anti-safety legislation. There is no fear, accountability or concern with these bad eggs. NYPD has been crippled and the latest push to mandate officers take out personal liability insurance is insulting. And why does it take a shooting on Halloween for our public officials to take notice of what every UWSer has known for years? And now we have the Smart Curbs pilot rolling out between 72nd and 86th; has any elected official spent more than a passing moment in their taxpayer-funded car to experience what is occurring on these corners? Have they spoken to business owners who lie awake at night wondering how to make payroll because poverty crime theft is putting them out of business? I love New York and while I would like to believe our appointed & elected City & State officials have our best interests in mind, sadly I’ve lost faith but they can check the box that a week after the shooting, they got their free media coverage for their constituents approval.
Across the street from McDonald toward north an empty store space is available . Previously it was deli with many tables and chairs. Police station could move in there and watch teenagers after high school classes through windows.
Luckily no one is selling stolen stuff on pavement there, that could be from nearby Walgreens.
You’re oversimplifying the process of establishing a police presence with a fixed police station. It’s not as simple as putting officers behind glass in a storefront. The NYPD has mobile command centers that could move around to wherever a presence is needed.
No unaccompanied minors allowed in the McDonalds, no garrisoning of delivery bikes outside, and a persistent police presence, it would improve pretty quick and nobody would need to shut down any business. And while kids certainly deserve healthy diversions after school, the parents of these kids also bear some responsibility here.
Between banning minors from burger and fries joints and a $200 million 5-year plaza/streets re-design…I think you and Brewer are really onto something productive in fighting gun crimes. The connection is clear and entirely scientific.
Did you want the Supreme Court to just tell McD to ban all unaccompanied minors nationwide, or the VP of Corp Communications at McD just to issue an entirely non-discriminatory press release about this specific location only? Something nice, like, “Your child is a potential gun criminal and we can’t have them in our esteemed establishment.”
What shall we do about Gray’s Papaya? Razor barbed wire?
You want to force a private business to exclude a certain age group from their premises? Who’s next on your list?
exactly — why should any group of law abiding citizens, minors or not, be excluded because of the actions of a small group.
If the plaza is too crowded and that is causing the crime, isn’t the obvious solution to expand the plaza? Like by taking back some of the space used by cars? When you hear people talk about how we need to remove some of the people (students) or businesses (MacDonalds) to make more space, and not pay attentions to how little public space is given to people not in cars, you realize that none of our politicians really get it.
Crime does not occur because the area is “too crowded”.
The “solution” to “crime” is not to make the plaza bigger.
BTW the vast majority of vehicles are commercial including a lot of ecommerce.
(Anyone who is getting ecommerce is contributing to vehicles on the streets)
Building development inevitably generate vehicles….luxury high-rises keep going up….
Great! Now can you explain (we’re waiting!) how getting rid of people’s cars will (a) stop hurricanes from happening so often; (b) reduce the number of sidewalk sheds, and maybe (c) cure cancer?
Is there *anything* the bike-bike-bike lobby can’t find as an excuse to take people’s cars away?
The answer isn’t always take away space used by cars…..Get rid of the seating area (that may not have a permit to exist anyway) and I suspect that all of the bikes that are there will disappear as well.
“But the guns are a huge issue. It’s kids with guns, that’s the scary part.”
This is the problem – how are kids getting guns?!
Those kids aren’t “locals.” They are guests in this neighborhood and have absolutely no respect for the people and families that live here.
Last year a little after 9am, I watched one of them run behind a woman, snatch her cell phone out of her hands, then run off as a group of them laughed and cheered him on from that very corner.
Whatever the reason to send them all to a school in a neighborhood they don’t live in, I think it’s safe to say we have enough data to show it has not had any positive impact on their lives.
The real answer is to send them to school where they actually live. Paying for after school activities none of them will do anyway is pointless. Maybe pay for mandatory buses parked right outside the side they all have to get on at dismissal and head home. I’d happily pitch in on that.
Helen Rosenthal just won reelection unopposed for the 100th time, she is not gonna do anything meaningful here so we can’t wait for her.
Helen Rosenthal has (thankfully) been out of our lives for some years now. It was Linda Rosenthal who was just re-elected.
Linda Rosenthal represents us in the State Assembly, in Albany; the kids with guns in and around McDonald’s are mostly a city issue. It’s our city council representative, Gale Brewer, who should be the first one addressing this for us. But her long, dismal record suggests (as other commenters here have written) that you’re right: she’s not going to do anything meaningful here — she never has before — so we can’t wait for her.
Best hope is in next year’s mayoral election. Change comes from the top.
Amen. It’s really frustrating to look at a ballot with no opposition. I’m a D who has voted for Rs many times. Given the recent election results, perhaps some local Rs will consider running for local seats (and judgeships!).
So instead of actually deterring criminals with harsh punishments or conducting searches for guns some are proposing just closing a McDonalds that provides affordable meals for poor people and teenagers. I guess I can see why some people find Trumps rhetoric around violent criminals appealing. Progressives really have lost their ability to connect to people with common sense initiatives.
Did you just say McDonalds provides affordable meals for poor people and teenagers?! First off, no there are food banks for poor people and second, McDonalds is about as an unhealthy of a food option as possible, LOL! Not to mention, it is NOT affordable by any stretch.
Brad Hoylman, who supports letting criminals off with no bail, and favors some of the most lenient treatment of dangerous criminals amongst any politician is saying we must find solutions? Oh do tell!
The solution starts with electing different politicians.
But you all keep electing the same politicians because you’re hung up on which party they belong to.
Part of the problem is that the democratic machine in NYC keeps backing the same people over and over again and allow for workarounds to term limits. Outsiders, even those that are democrats, stand no chance of getting on a ballot in NYC.
I took my 11 year old son to vote with me and I let him look over the ballot. He said two things to me that were telling: (1) why are some people running and no one else is running against them? and (2) why do you get to pick 6 people to be judges and they are all democrat and there are only 6 to choose from?
So I just walked by there, I looked around and saw no police presence.
In a different WSR article about crime, it was mentioned that cops standing outside LULULEMON do nothing to respond to anything around them. Scandalous.
“The shooting was a horror that woke people up,” City Councilmember Gale Brewer told West Side Rag.”
No. Woke YOU up, Gale. We’ve been aware for a long time.
The real solution is stop having kids sit in a building for 8 hours. How are you going to have 8 to 18 year olds with all that energy sit around for 8 hours and then just ask him to go home, the whole thing of being a kid is to hang out and be social with your friends but if you can’t do it in school like you want to then you find a way to do it after school. And, some of those kids don’t want to go home because going home is worse than being at school with their friends, so they want to try to extend their day as much as possible. As adults lets start having empathy for the kids and find solutions for them. How about we rework the public school system, and change from that old factory teaching system that been in place since God knows when what the Industrial Revolution. Why do we not think that kids sitting around for 8 hours a day, with pent up energy because we know kids in high school and younger have a lot of energy throughout the day how about not sitting around for that long. It’s funny that when we become adults we forget who we were as kids, and we complicate kids’ lives as adults even though we were kids.
there are roughly 900,000 kids that attend public schools in NYC and they sit in class for 8+ hours a day and I would venture to guess that a good number of them have horrible home situations. Yet, they manage to hang out after school without causing problems or getting into trouble. Sorry, but I don’t think the answer is reworking the public school model.
The problem of delivery guys congregating is a big one not only here but by the McDonalds on 8th Ave at W.56th. They have overwhelmed the plaza across the street and while hopefully no crimes are being committed the overall picture is one of loitering and to a degree disorder.
Design problem? The plaza’s the problem? How willfully blind can politicians be? The problem is undisciplined kids in dysfunctional schools that exist primarily to pay lousy teachers to be glorified babysitters. A total overhaul of the school system is needed to ensure that children are taught manners, respect and discipline, along with the fundamentals of reading, writing, arithmetic, science and, oh yes, morality. Until this is done, the problem will not go away regardless of the street, block or neighborhood.
The problem is the consumers. Who is getting McDonald’s delivered to their apartment?! Is that not the definition of laziness/unhealthy eating habits?
I think Trump eats McDonald’s food daily. Maybe DA Alvin Bragg can indict Trump again for causing the problems at this specific location.
I am. I have it delivered 3x every day, 3 streets over. It is the definition of laziness and unhealthy eating habits. I’m going to go surrender at the precinct now and accept the responsibility for gun crimes in the area.
Could it be all these marijuana stores popping up in the neighborhood lately as well? People are hanging out and loitering on the corner in front of the pizza shop and McDonald’s, I’m sure these businesses are not happy either, but the answer lies, the solution lies addressing the outside area, not the business’s fault.
McDonalds is a family restaurant institution, and the Pizza place has excellent Pizza had never had any issues in the past. Not to mention Starbucks right there. Police presence would detour these incidents to start.
Should definitely be resolved sooner than later and brought up religiously at the meetings.
DID YOU PEPLE NOT READ THE ARTICLE?
“The shooting happened around the corner on West 71st Street toward West End Avenue, but the teenager from the MLK school then walked into the McDonald’s and asked for help.”
Interesting how opinions turn to more cops, more security, close the McD. What about after school programs for kids that kids would actually enjoy. So tired of fellow white people picking up pitchforks when the kids involved are black and brown. More money, more programs, inclusion and support.
Wait, this is clearly not a congestion problem. There are higher congestion areas just up the street from here that don’t have these issues. Putting aside that congestion does not cause crime, this is a wide plaza area that has multiple businesses that cater to a crowd that brings with it a higher crime rate. I’m not so sure plaza redesign would change that. They already tried it at least once.
Pizza restaurants, Starbucks, and McDonalds cater to higher crime rate individuals?
The issue is also the other establishments on that street, most notably the CBD KRATOM dispensary. It’s time to hold business accountable for the sort of behavior they promote and permit from their patrons.
If i were Ms Brewer,
I would install permanent, fixed tables and chairs with chess boards. Elders could teach young ones how to play. Perhaps McDonalds could even sponsor such a plan. When nobody is playing it becomes a place to have a picnic. Even teens are allowed to ‘hang out’ in public spaces. Gun control is out of control in all age brackets.
Bicycles should park only in bike racks. Food service places should pay for more bike racks on the bias against the building, keeping them out of the way of pedestrians.
Just what i would do if i were able.
“Blast” opera music
🙂
Opera has been used in various places to discourage teenagers from hanging around….and apparently quite successful.
LOL.
There have been a few comments that high school students are hanging out because there are insufficient after school programs.
Might WSR report on after-school options at MLK Jr high school?
LaGuardia?
Are there any ‘After School Programs’? There should be..
The entire area around the 72nd St. subway station is a “problem plaza”; the part near the McDonalds is only a portion of the problem. What’s needed is more police presence, more cleanliness, getting rid of the buskers, and making it more attractive for ordinary (and older) people to pass through or sit down in.
What buskers?
Someone who sings, plays, or performs in a public place so that people will give money. Could this be after school performing arts activities?
No mention of the projects nearby? I do agree that these young people need alternative opportunities. Not sure that it has much to do with congestion.
That corner is very dangerous and has been for years. When my daughter was a child, 20 -22 years ago, we made a regular stop at MacDonalds on our way home from summer-camp pick-up; she loved McNuggets and I loved to make her happy, even though I knew it was glorified junk. It was not unsafe then. Now, I would never ever ever walk there. Not ever. The weed shops, the frightening and often violent school kids– how can this be dealt with? Or can it? My advice to all my UWS neighbors–stay away if you value your safety. An appalling state of affairs.
Well, if Gale Brewer is involved in something, you can be guaranteed that the actual issues won’t be addressed but a lot of distractions will be introduced. She is great in addressing non-issues and masking pressing issues with something only marginally related.
Outdoor seating? Congestion? The mere existence of McDonalds? Really?
We all know that the actual problem is unruly kids from MLK. That’s how it has been for years. Except a few years ago, the police sort of escorted them to the subway and they didn’t loiter. With our new administration starting with De Blasio and now local rep Gale, the police doesn’t do anything to try to encourage these kids move on. The laws have changed and Hoylman-Sigal is one of the politicians who introduced it. Now we all have to pretend that it is not the issue.
The root of the problem is the owner of those leased storefronts. I believe it to be the condo/coop in back. They decide who to lease the storefronts to. I’m sure McDonald’s is a great source of revenue for them but its the board of that condo who decides on suitable tenants. More pressure needs to be put on them as a major player in this effort to clean up that block.
As I understand it, you are not correct. The building is essentially split into two large condo unites – the retail and the residential. The residential portion is run by the condo board made up of building residents. owernship of the retail condo “unit” was retained by the original owner/developer (may or not have been transferred to other owners) who controls the leasing — the residents do not.
No one knew this area was problematic? Sure. That’s why they made The Panic in Needle Park over half a century ago. Everything has always been fine in that area.
For what it is worth…..concerns in Hell’s Kitchen too.
https://w42st.com/post/teenager-stabbed-in-hells-kitchen-police-investigation-continues/