By Joy Bergmann
When ordering in via an online portal like Seamless, who is responsible for the behavior of the delivery guy? The restaurant? Seamless? Like many relationships spawned by the digital age, it’s complicated. So learned the CB7 Business & Consumer Issues Committee at its Wednesday night meeting.
Attorney Meagan Jaglowski from GrubHub, parent company of Seamless, responded to concerns sparked by a recent confrontation Committee co-chair George Zeppenfeldt-Cestero had with a delivery person not wearing an identifying vest, but carrying bags emblazoned with the Seamless logo. Delivery bicyclists have to wear vests with the names of their restaurants on the back (like the one at right), so if they break rules their employers can be held responsible.
Jaglowski said that – up until very recently – restaurants that signed up with online ordering systems like Grubhub would be responsible for finding and managing their own delivery people. GrubHub might provide restaurants with logo-laden bags and vests as marketing giveaways, she said, but, “it’s discretionary for [restaurants] to adopt them.”
But Jaglowski said GrubHub is modifying its NYC business model and offering its own team of delivery people to be used by restaurants who do not wish to manage cyclists. Because such GrubHub cyclists would serve multiple restaurants, a particular restaurant would not be identified on their vests.
Zeppenfeldt-Cestero said CB7 has helped pioneer the DOT rules governing commercial cyclists, including the rule that they identify the restaurant they work for on their vest. “We were ahead of the curve on these issues,” he said.
Emphasis on “were.” The rules were adopted in 2012, a veritable Stone Age in the new “gig economy” typified by Door Dash and distinguished by the relationship such services have with their delivery drivers and cyclists: independent contractors, not employees.
Committee co-chair Michele Parker read an email from DOT confirming that, “Seamless [GrubHub] does not have to put restaurants’ names on their vests.”
According to a GrubHub media rep, nothing forbids its contractors from simultaneously logging into several services they might choose to deliver for, setting up a scenario where one delivery guy may make runs for Caviar, Door Dash and Seamless in a given hour.
Board members emphasized the need for GrubHub and others to find a way to visually ID their delivery independent contractors. “We’re not trying to put anyone in harm’s way,” said Jaglowski.
Several local restaurateurs said online ordering had been a boon to their businesses. Safety remains a concern and customers have a role to play, said Michele Casadei Massari from Piccolo Café, “We have to be more understanding as consumers and quit demanding dinner in 15 minutes.”
By the end, Luca Di Pietro appeared undecided about offering delivery from his Taralucci E Vino, asking the million-dollar question, “So who’s liable?”
Given the litigation surrounding Uber drivers’ classification as employees under California law, but independent contractors elsewhere, we non-lawyers at WSR are taking the 5th on that one.
Why are you calling these “rules” when the link you provided to the rules calls them laws? If they are laws how can Grub Hub say their new business model can’t follow them? If your business model doesn’t comply to the laws it can’t be your model.
The problem is the law refers to employees of restaurants.
GrubHub is not a restaurent. Their delivery people are not employees (according to them). Does the law apply to their contractors?
Seems like the law probably needs to be amended.
Someone should police the cyclists in general, but if there is a loophole in this law for any business, there shouldn’t be one new bike lane until it’s closed.
Can we shut the roads down until you figure out how Uber works too?
That seems awfully punitive towards your neighbors who are looking for safe bike lanes on our streets for ourselves and our businesses.
We don’t ask for not one more taxi pickup on the Upper West Side after 61 UWS taxi collisions in November, or not one more pothole to be filled until drivers stop crashing and speeding, or not one more restaurant order to be delivered on the UWS until the law changes and perfection is achieved. Why would we?
Bike lanes are essential! This is counter-productive scapegoating. There were 12 UWS crashes between cyclists and people on foot over the entire year 2014. You can look that up, DOT publishes annual numbers. These numbers should all be zero, of course, but we had 35 injury or fatal collisions with drivers in a single month on the UWS. Protected bike lanes help make wide streets much more safe for all of us by designating to everyone where cyclists should ride, and can ride with less fear. Please, please reconsider what you’re asking for when you refuse to support a safe lane for the guy who’s delivering your dinner in the rain, or the UWSer who’s biking to the movies or home from work.
Makes perfect sense. Let’s stall the installation of a bike lane that not only benefits delivery cyclists but the entire community because of a loophole in the law that an internet company is capitalizing on.
There are much more important things to police than delivery guys on bikes in the first place
Yes, this is important.
Some of these delivery guys ride their bikes like maniacs on both the streets and sidewalks.
These delivery men are on bikes with motors which are much more lethal than bikes without.
I think the word loophole is totally appropriate here. These laws were passed before anyone could imagine anyone other than restaurants delivering their own meals. Now that GrubHub has entered the picture (and a few others) the laws need to be amended to accommodate businesses which provide services like these. And also take a view toward the future of delivery services/businesses which deal with not only restaurants but all kind of goods and services. Similar to FedEx or UPS. They need to be held responsible for the practices of their messengers…. should school them on legal practices and should take insurance responsibility for them and anyone they injure.
I dont understand why seamless or individual restaurants should be involved at all. Why not simply register the bike delivery guys themselves by name, at a nominal fee. This would identify them no matter for whom they are working. And if they break the law (repeatedly) they lose their license/vest.
The restaurants are held responsible because they have deep pockets compared to the delivery guys. They tell/force the delivery guys to be as speedy as possible knowing that might involve going the wrong way on one way streets. It’s like when Dominos used to promise delivery in 30 minutes and their drivers drove recklessly. Dominions had to change their policy because it encouraged illegal driving.
On the point of delivery guys having numbered vests — all cyclists should be required to have some kind of identifying number. Delivery bikes are the worst offenders regarding bike laws but other rogue cyclists should also be identifiable if when they cause accidents.
What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. In that case so should pedestrians have and ID Vest. There are rogue pedestrians with their noses buried deep in their smartphones causing accidents too. Much to their detriment of course but equivalently responsible.
I would like to see jaywalkers, especially those looking at their phones tickets. Bicycles, for deliveries or recreation, should have something like a license plate just like cars. I would think that falls under your “what’s good for the goose is good for the gander” line of reasoning.
@david s:
It’s a question of cost-benefit analysis. You become numb to it, but motor vehicles are *SO* much more destructive than bicycles when things go wrong it isn’t even funny. There’s just no universe where registering riders ends up being a good safety investment.
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Also, there’s a generally-recognized constitutional right to travel under traditional forms of power. Walking or cycling is a right; driving is a privilege.
Mark: Yes this would cost money, just as registering and providing plates for automobiles costs money. Motorists finance that with a registration fee. What would be unreasonable about charging bicyclists a fee to register their vehicles?
Mr./Mrs. UWSer, motorist hit pedestrians and ride off too, even with those big tags attached to the front and back bumpers.
Every time there has been an effort to “plate” or license bicycles it has failed before it even got off the ground. The reason for it is mostly due to cost. It would be counter productive since it would cost a lot more money than it would generate.
I believe Australia at one point attempted it to the point where a number of tags where issued but shortly after abandoned the program due to excessive costs. Here in the US a number of municipalities have also thrown the idea around but as soon as they figure out the budget the idea is tossed out.
license plates on bicycles allows them to be tracked to their owner. Just like with cars. Is that difficult to understand? Cyclists need to obey laws just like cars and pedestrians. Making pedestrians have an identification number is much more difficult. Cyclists now can hit pedestrians and ride off. The sight impaired are at particularly high risk because the bikes going the wrong way or not stopping at lights don’t make any noise. Even if someone witnesses this they have no way of reporting the cyclist.
This all costs money. Do you want to create a Department of Non-Motor Vehicles…? Bureaucracy, lines, paperwork… and what have you accomplished? License plates on bicycles… which does what… exactly…?
It would be nice to see CB7’s business committee express as much concern about restaurants and delivery services possibly breaking labor laws as it expresses about their underpaid and exploited workers violating the “rules of the road.”
Vests are only the start. All the bikes should have lights, not so that they can see us but so that we can see them. And a little common sense, please: they should wear light-colored clothes. At night, that guy in the top photo would be practically invisible until it’s too late.
I second this. Bike headlights (and car headlights for that matter) in NYC are basically useless for illuminating the road for the cyclist, they’re primarily for letting others (people and cars) see the bicycle. I believe that those lights (not reflectors) are mandated in NYC. I suspect the delivery people don’t like them because (a) the batteries run out, (b) good ones get stolen
My big concern about delivery cyclists — and all cyclists — is that they ride after dark without a light in the front, through red lights, and against traffic, so it’s very dangerous for pedestrians. Who is doing something about this?
Nobody’s doing anything about it. Pedestrians don’t matter.
If the city wants to get serious about cyclists obeying traffic laws, it has to start ticketing cyclists who break the laws. It’s that simple.
I’d be far more Draconian than that, if there is an incident where it turns out the delivery guy is undocumented, turn him over to ICE. The rest will get the message in no time and won’t be so quick to zoom along on the sidewalks of WEA on their electric bikes.
Well, that would be the end of that industry.
Actually, not true.
https://www.westsiderag.com/2015/12/09/tickets-to-bicyclists-spike-but-nypd-sees-room-for-improvement-on-auto-enforcement
Who cares ??? Just get my food here fast and hot !!
Ever since the advent of the Internet, there has been an assault on our laws. No, you can’t steal an artist’s work for your financial gain just because you perpetrated the theft electronically. Similarly, the law surrounding agency hasn’t disappeared just because we interface electronically with the agents of the principal. (There used to be common law barring the use of deadly force in the protection of property, but that is being eroded by the barbarians among us.)
Nothing will be done. All these delivery guys are illegals working for cash. Just another example of how ‘progressive’ NYC exploits illegals. As long as you get your Chinese food in 15 mins who cares right? Nail salons, restaurants, food deliveries, barbacks etc. All illegals who wont want to register with anyone.