PS 191 on West 61st street has been in the news amidst a plan to rezone the neighborhood around the school. Much has been made of the discrepancy between PTA fundraising at 199, which raised $800,000 last year, and at 191, which educates children from more modest backgrounds and does not have an art teacher or a library.
Parents at 191 are trying to boost fundraising, in particular with an event this weekend, and teachers are asking for help for specific projects in the classroom. We’ve included information below on how to help.
PS 191 PTA is sponsoring an art fair in its schoolyard this coming Saturday, November 7th from 11 am to 4 pm. Artists can set up a table for free at the fair this weekend (there may be a charge for future fairs) and people can come by and purchase all sorts of art. The flyer here explains the event, and this one explains how artists can sign up.
On the website Donors Choose, people can also donate to various projects. Teachers put up the solicitations, so just click through to learn more.
iPads for special ed teacher to teach 1st graders
Money for Alvin Ailey Dance Residency
Why does it have to be apple I-pads? I guess you might as well go for the best
P.S. 191 has gone live with a Gofundme site to raise money for their library.
http://www.gofundme.com/ps191
I am a 199 Parent and I personally know Ms. Cumbo, 191’s movement teacher. Her work is so inspiring and I have contributed to her quest to get her kids an Alvin Ailey residency. Please consider joining us in supporting her efforts! She has only 2 weeks left to raise the money.
It has been many years since I have been in school and a year until my son starts but I would assume that most schools use technology like iPads in class these days.
I think this art sale is a great idea. I also thought a regular farmers market could work. There is the space which the cramped market near Century 21 lacks.
I was also shocked about the lack of library. I would like to see a drive to raise funds for one – I am sure many members of the community would be willing to donate books also.
As terrible as it is that a public school does not have a library, this is apparently not so unusual recently, at least in cities like New York and Los Angeles. I say this not to normalize (and condone) the fact, but rather to normalize the school. Lots of schools have problems, and PS191 is just one of them. In any case, to be clear, the staff and children at PS191 want and need a library, and the PTA is working hard to raise money (including applying for grants) to build one. The process is very slow. If you or others would like to donate, contact: pta@museummagnet.com. Thank you!
Helen Rosenthal built a garden at 191. She believed a garden, not a library, would help a school where only 12% pass the state English and math tests.
Way to go Helen, how’d it work out. The kids need a library not a garden.
Maybe the PS 199 PTA should consider sharing a portion of their $800,000 with PS 191, along the lines of the Chancellor recommendation.
Thank you for posting this WSR. It is good to hear directly from the teachers/parents on ways to help. On the PTAs, maybe the PTAs could do a joint event with most proceeds going to 191 or involve all D3 PTAs with proceeds going to schools with less funds.
When PS199 raises money, it’s for programs at PS199. There are specific programs and supply requirements that the school identifies for its students and classrooms, and those are what the fundraising addresses. It’s not like the school simply says “load up our bank account and we’ll figure out what to do with it later,” it’s a well thought out process and continual planning that spans across years. If there’s a surplus at the end of a year, it is generally modest and seeds funding of the following year’s goals. PS199’s PTA works diligently to fund the goals it sets, presenting many events and outreach opportunities, but it’s a year-long effort and involves the commitment of a very active parent body. PS191’s problems have nothing to do with “modest backgrounds,”they have to do with the fact that PS191’s parent body has not had a substantial level of involvement or commitment to success that PS199 has, and it’s irresponsible to expect PS199’s PTA to now hand out their funded dollars for the improvement effort at PS191, where no significant effort of its own has been made before. The problems at PS191 are not new, they’ve been festering and growing year after year, and are now only in a new light because the pot has boiled over with the newer “persistently dangerous” label being put on it. As a community, you reap what you sow, and regardless of socio-economics the PS191 community simply hasn’t been sowing from the resources of its own community – not money, but commitment, time, devotion and direction. All the money in the world isn’t going to help very much without those cornerstones being established, nurtured, and built bigger over time.
Wholeheartedly agree.
I can understand this response but I don’t think this is such a crazy idea. Maybe a little glitchy to initially explain and implement, but the bottom line is these schools are fewer than 10 blocks away and especially at a time when zoning lines and “rules” will be amended (if not for next year, soon), helping PS191 be a better school ultimately benefits everyone in the general vicinity, not to mention starts to chip away at the major problems in the NYC public school system, and deeper problems having to do with race and class.
No, clearly you don’t understand the response. When donors give money to a not-for-profit and RESTRICT their contributions to a specific program or period it cannot be re-allocated to just anything. Doing so is not acceptable under GAAP and not-for-profit accounting. In order to give funds to the other school PS199 would have to get permission for each donor to re-allocate their funds to PS 191.
Greed! PS 199 is an academically decaying, over-crowded, under-staffed school.
Except that parents gave to the 199 PTA to support programs at their own school. The PTA can’t just up and give that money to another school.
This story never ends, however what was noted today is so sad. PS 191 has no art teacher or library. It should be against the law to have a school with no library, let alone an art teacher.
The MuseumMagnet school/PS 191 has a dance teacher, a music teacher, and a drama teacher. They have been a focus school with LCE (Lincoln Center Education) for over 20 years. There was a long positive partnership with SIAS (Studio in a School) but that costs money and that the school does not have. Teachers use their knowledge about early childhood and elementary education pedagogy and their units with LCE to build art into the curriculum. It would be great if the powers that be who decide budgets for schools would provide enough money to hire an art teacher. That is not the school’s decision. It is also the same reason why despite having a library many years ago, it was defunct – no money for a librarian. It is great the PTA is putting a library together again. There is still the question of having enough money for a librarian part time or full time. But meanwhile each classroom has a rich classroom library to support the work until we have a bigger one.
An elementary school should not be allowed to have no library. Why aren’t the raising money for books and a librarian? Where are the suggested donations of are supplies and a teacher?
As I mentioned above, the school is aware it lacks a library, and would greatly benefit form one, and the PTA is in fact trying to raise money to create one. But individual classes and teachers also need resources (every student, at least in Pre-k and K, at the start of the year is given a lengthy list of supplies to buy and bring in for all the students to share). These are not mutually exclusive. Why should they be? Most institutions have several needs, at different levels, for which fundraising is conducted.
Nobody needs iPad minis.
Why not? Are you aware of the educational benefits of periodically using ipads or tablets in the classroom. What do you think the kids are doing with them? Do you think they are getting to play any app they want for any amount of time? Perhaps intelligent teachers have downloads strategic apps that help support specific points of learning. Or perhaps they are a great resource on a trip to record nature through video or photographs. Perhaps the speech-language impaired child can use it to help get their point across because other modalities of communication are more difficult. Personally I think these kids will be look at ipads in 30 years the way we look back at apple IIc. This is only the tip of the iceberg. They will know so much more in technology when they are our age, why not let them get started now? And yes I have research it because I did not want to get an ipad (a tablet would have been so much cheaper) – they do have by far better educational apps than other tablets.
Shouldn’t the DOE fund the library. It’s their school.
Maryjane, the software and apps are written for iPad.
The question of whether wealthier neighborhoods should be able to further boost their own schools while leaving other schools behind is a difficult one. But it is shocking that we, collectively, apparently do not consider a library to be an absolute necessity in every school. How can we begin to think we offer equal opportunity, or even adequate opportunity, to all?
Thanks for letting us know about this event. I just donated.
Thank you so much for donating!!
PS 87 got a huge infusion of grant money a few years back. The principal chose to buy iPads for all the teachers with some of the money. As far as I could tell, this was a huge waste of money. The iPads were not used for teaching, and the most effective teaching was done with traditional methods. Not sure why PS 191 needs iPads. I’d be happy to help them out with building their library.
What you are describing is a top down approach. The principal decides that the teachers are going to do a particular initiative (like use iPads) – and it may or may not be adopted.
Donnors Choose is bottom up. The teachers on this site need resources for specific projects that they and their students are excited about. Let’s put our money where our mouth is and support them!!!
I can only speak about the teacher who is raising money for the three iPads. She has been working at PS191 for 15 years and is one of the best the school has. She believes having three more tablets will enhance her teaching, and the children’s learning, and the classroom experience. But still, I understand that some people may feel this is not a personal priority for their donations. If you would like to donate to 191 for a library, please do!
Twodogs – can a teacher at the school please start a fund ASAP to outfit a library?
I would like to contribute to buying shelves and other fixtures. As for books, I have participated in book drives for other libraries, and would love to help set one up for PS191. Should I email that PTA email that you gave?
Really? She can’t teach without iPads? How did people manage it before tablets?
The kids need books, not iCrap.
I toured 191 in 2007 and there was a beautiful library. It was not as well stocked as the other D3 schools I toured, but it was a large space with great light. What happened to it?
There was never a great library. What used to be the media center is now the computer lab. They have identified a specific room that can become the library. The biggest issue is that they don’t even have any books for classrooms to share!
Are you saying that they have books (in the basement?) and a room. But no shelves and fixtures and thats the only thing preventing them from getting a Library?
There must be more to it than that because I could – and would – literally fix that problem in an one afternoon at Ikea and then post on here for volunteers and sort it out within the week.
I also wanted to clarify that the Media Center is brand new, no computer lab. It is a huge beautiful media center, state of the art, funded by Gail Brewer. The information and pictures are on the school’s website. We had the grand opening last year.
Ok. Thanks for clarifying .
That is a lie!
There was functioning library with a librarian for years until the DOE cut the budget. It became the media center because it was not being utilized as a library because NO DOE FUNDING!
Each classroom has a large classroom library. With a wide range of book that meet the children’s developing needs and for sheer enjoyment.
Most of the books that were in the library, if not distributed to classrooms are in the basement.
The PTA is trying to raise funding for the appropriate furnishings. shelving – tables chairs….. Maybe one day we can get a librarian
three more? how many does she have now?
17 years teaching the school, 21 teaching.
3 ipads because one was stolen and has never been back online to trace.
With 18 children in the the class plus my personal one I was able to do groups of 3 or 4. One down only allows for groups of 4 or 5 – too big. So I figured asking for 3 more would allow reasonable groupings at 3 children. The child proof stands/carriers just make sure they don’t break.
Last year we made two different movies using the ipads and our green screen in our media center. We used them to create a comic book about being safe and healthy in school. we have taken them on trips to take pictures of what we see. And strategic apps are chosen and introduced at different times to help supplement the curriculum or help children with skills they need more practice with. They are not used everyday. Because we do NOT need that much screen time. But they are an invaluable tool to have in the classroom if we can get them.
Also the Pre-K assessment tool that the school chose out of the menu of three provided by the DOE has an app that helps record and document real time observations of the children meeting the Pre-K common core objectives. It then is translated into a parent report and teacher tool for future planning.
ipads are not toys in a school building.
I believe she has two. So she would like five iPads for 17-20 kids.
The City’s Public School system has been in shambles for over 50 years. Several issues plaque this system.
One of the biggest issues is you have three Unions running the circus: Principle; Teacher; and Custodian union. All three have different agendas (and none involving the best interest of the student). Similar to what was done back in the early 1990’s with the three police departments, they should all be combined into one.
Also, and more importantly, the Chancellor’s position should become an elected official chosen by the people, to serve the people. Forget about political assignments resulting from political favors. I want a Chancellor who can be held responsible for the good and the bad decisions being made. Someone who can be voted out of office or someone who can be re-elected. Albany and City Hall need to relinquish power to the voters of NYC. Only then will we see much needed support of our school system.
Newsflash to all of those stuck in the 1950’s. iPads and internet access ARE the new library.
I think these kids deserve a library, new technologies, and books in the classroom. It should not have to be one or the other.
Thanks you Talksback for all the great info.
WSR, thank you for the links.
I too am curious about the IPad/library thing. Especially when a kid was recently and notoriously flipped on her head in another state for daring to take out a smartphone in class, there is not all that much difference btw an IPhone and an Ipad other than voice calling. But I digress. My question is, from anyone with kids in PS199, are IPads routinely and intelligently used in the classrooms there?
Great question… please read my comments above.
Personally, I think smart phones are great learning tools. I personally have used mine to take pictures of power point slides to refer to later. But phones are removed form kids because they text, facebook, and do other things they are not supposed to. I wish it weren’t so. It would be nice if we could have an honor system with the kids and their phones.
PS199 teachers use iPads, students do not.
Thanks for posting these links. After reading all of the vitriol in these pages for the past few weeks over the redistricting plan, it is very helpful to see something positive those of us who do not have children can do to contribute to the schools.
I have many friends who are teachers and some use iPads in the classroom. There’s lots of educational software out there that is very effective in the classroom. The whole point of Donors Choose is that you get to evaluate the need – if you don’t want to support iPads, cool, that’s your choice, don’t do it. But please don’t pile on unnecessarily to the teachers who think that, as a tool, the iPad is effective in their classroom. They are the ones in the classroom “on the ground” and it is absolutely fair for them to make requests for what they think they need.
I donated to one of the projects – thanks WSR for highlighting them!
PS 199 should donate some of the 800, 000 raised by the PTA to support their neiboring school.
Or how about all the developers putting up new buildings in the zone (now and in the last few years) donate money to the school. I know the PTA is doing a great job – if not doing so already perhaps they could approach building developers and building management companies in the 191 zone like Equity Residential and Brodsky for donations.
Actually Chancellor Farina had also suggested in her Town Hall that schools could share in that way through a “sister schools” system.
It’s not the responsibility of one school to fund another.
Doe needs to provide our kids with libraries, books, resources
It may not be the responsibility of 199 parents to help. However, with sites like Dinners Choose we have the option to do so – which is great. Some people have enough money to give to multiple organizations so it does not have to be a zero sum game.
How grateful am I ? I live and teach in this amazing community. I have read and experienced so many comments that do not reflect the people I know in this community. I do teach at 191, I know so many beautiful children and parents that live in this community. I am so proud of the positive people in my community who funded two of my co-workers projects today on Donorschoose.org. Teachers know what they need to enhance what they want to do in their classroom. I am feeling overwhelmed with gratitude for the love and support that has been given to my school today. My heart feels so happy for the love and support that was shown to my school today. I may not know you personality, but I do know that you are a part of the solution and I am so very grateful for your support of PS191, it does take a villiage!
Thank you for all the love and support that has been given to PS191 this week..Thank you for coming to our art fair and supporting me and my fellow teachers on Donorschoose.org. We are only as strong as our weakest link, thank you for putting some strength around us. It is uplifting and encouraging. We are an amazing community with amazing schools, we just have to remember to love our neighbors as we love ourselves and we will all grow and flourish.
Cumbo,
Keep up your good work. You definitely have your heart in the right place, so don’t be discouraged that “I have read and experienced so many comments that do not reflect the people I know in this community.”
I was a teacher in The Bronx. My wife recently retired from the Manhattan schools. I am from three generations of family educated in the NYC Public Schools (my mother in Harlem, my father and I both in The Bronx, and my children here on the UWS.
Stay commited. You know what is right and the children will benefit. Just don’t let the destroyers get you down.
don’t have any problem with children being taught dance at school I think it’s an important thing however I want Westsiders to know that although Alvin Ailey may be a great dance studio it has received the benefit of $32 million worth of donations from the wife of Sandy Weill the banker who may have caused the recession- he certainly broke the regulations that changed our banking system that used to separate banks and investment firms.
So much for advancement on merit!
I’m not sure I agree that Sandy Weill broke the rules (if you object to what he did, your unhappiness may result from the fact that the rules themselves didn’t prohibit the behavior you don’t like) – but either way, what does that mean about Ailey? It is an extraordinary cultural institution that brings arts to children ranging from the most talented and high-level dancers to kids who (like me) may have no talent whatsoever but (unlike me) are able to access incredible dance programs and learn and grow in the arts. I do not know whether this program is the only or best way for kids to have access to dance, but it is an amazing program for kids who do have the opportunity to do it.
Thank you West Side Rag for posting this! The PS191 PTA is planing to make this a weekly fair, and I bought some lovely holiday gifts for my family, beautiful jewelry for myself! This is such a great way to support the school so please drop by one weekend soon.
Talksback says PS 191 has a dance teacher, a music teacher, and a drama teacher. It sounds like the principal has prioritized these things over a librarian. It baffles me that we keep hearing how awful it is the the school lacks a library (and I agree that is awful) if this is something that is done at the school’s discretion. My child attends a very well regard public school that has a wonderful library but no dance or drama teacher.
Please read the above comments about why there is no librarian. I don’t think you understood. Or you are making the assumption that the dance, music, and drama positions were created instead of a library. Those teaching positions have always been there. The position title may have changed as a teacher with a certain expertise retired, but there are not suddenly more teachers int eh school. They were not created at the expense of a library.
What do you think I misunderstand? My understanding is that the principal gets $X for the school. At ps 191 some of this money is spent on drama and dance teachers. Why not eliminate those positions and get a librarian instead? I actually think kids drama and dance might be a better use of the money. I just don’t like the “it doesn’t have a library” complaint if they’ve chosen something instead of a library.
This is what I thought as well. At schools with well funded PTAs, the principal can get money to pay for cluster teachers. Obviously this was not an option at 191. The classrooms have individual libraries, the books from the original library are still in the school, and the public library is 5 blocks a way. Using the money for other programs makes sense. It seems that in attempting to garner support for the school, people are making things seem worse than they are. The new media center is amazing!
While I appreciate the sentiment behind this post, we must remember that there are other schools in District 3 in a similar situation. Maybe WSR can post information about these schools.
I appreciate the thinking behind the suggestion that 199’s PTA share some of its fundraising bounty with 191, and also appreciate why that’s not feasible.
That said, if 199 would like to chip away at the well-deserved reputation of being insular and (as) elitist (as a public school can get), they should consider a *community/neighbor/it takes a village* kind of fundraising drive specifically to benefit 191.
That would certainly help demonstrate the school’s “word hard, be kind” motto, and while not every 199 family has it to give, there are enough parents throwing $15k birthday parties there that I imagine such an effort could at least fund some of those iPad requests – not to mention start to foster some goodwill
https://www.donorschoose.org/project/alvin-ailey-dance-kids-we-would-love-a/1591117/
Community folks say that the families at 191 don’t do enough fundraising. Well, just maybe they don’t have the resources of the wealthier parents at 199. Maybe they are too busy taking care of grandchildren and trying to PUT FOOD on the table to bake cookies to sell! Let’s remember we are one community, pull together and help out. I just donated $100 to the Alvin Ailey program. Dancing is joyful; it doesn’t take the place of an art teacher or a library, but it is an inexpensive way to tell our neighbors that UWS residents are NOT happy with the HAVES and the HAVE NOTS. If you agree with me, donate NOW!!
When there was the giant controversy about space at 199 6 years ago, and the middle school in the building was being pushed out to open it up to the new residences of the Trump buildings, it was suggested at a PTA meeting at 199 that we co-sponsor 191, since it was once considered a “sister”school. It seemed like a great idea at the time – there is a huge dicotamy in income between the two schools, particularly now that 199 is occupied by the western edge of the west side. I couldn’t believe the reactions to the suggestion at the time – seemed like it would have made more than sense to find a way to combine the two schools (lower grades in one/upper in the other building?) to improve 191 an give the entire neighborhood first-rate choices.
Maybe PS 199, PS 191 and PS 452 should all join in the fund raising and share the spoils evenly amongst the three of them.
In five years everyone will want to go to 191 just like everyone now prefers 452 or 87 or even success academy over 199.
If that (the preference for 462, 87 or SA) were true, would we be seeing the current hysteria about 199 and keeping it closed? Would it even be overcrowding if it weren’t considered such a big deal?
Parentof199ers, as you know if they charge the zones and pre-schoolers you have will be grandfathered in whereas families with oldest children who are now 4 or under won’t be allowed in. None of these families are protesting being sent to 87 or 452.
Thanks for this – I just donated. Nice to help vs just complaining all the time.
Great to see concrete ways to help. I just donated and all but 2 projects were fully funded! Let’s get these last 2 projects funded UWS!